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Re: India's place in the world....



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Hello Vamsi,

Pardon my elucidiation. Any excess explaination is
only so that the context of discussion is clear -
especially to me.

You raised 2 points - please find my views below.

1. Slavery in the US.
It is important to understand that a constitution
(principles of forming a state and governance of the
same) is a framework that provides concretization of
moral and philosophical principles. For the US this
was individual rights. A constitution by no means can
gaurantee availability of that right to everybody at
all times. It is upon the individuals to call this
right for what it is if trampled upon and the state
would come to help according to constitutional
gaurantees.
If you've read any of the important materials
regarding formation of US (Federalist Papers,
Constitution and it's amendments are the most basic
and just fantastic to read) - you will understand that
the moral basis for eradication of slavery was always
provided. Madison and Jefferson understood that the
institution of slavery was an inherent contradiction
to the constitution and they themselves stopped
practising it.
Well to cut it short the laws were always against
slavery and all that was required was to invoke them
in self defense - some thing Martin Luther King did
phenominally. ( as a note:It is wrong to say that the
civil war was fought for eradication of slavery - it
was much more complex and many more issues were
involved)
Vamsi - perhaps you can point out a similar issue of
discrimination in another country where it was handled
the way it was in the US?

2. As you say self-interest is alive amongst all of
us. So how can one use it positively? That can only be
done where one is free to work and retain ownership of
that work with no one else having any claim to it. If
such a thing is not possible satisfaction of self -
interest happens in a destructive manner - i.e.
looting. The govt looting the people, the priests
looting the devout, the family looting the individual
etc. Ironically all in the name of sacrifice.
You are right that a society is needed to build dreams
from within - what kind of society is what we are
debating about here. Is it a society that promotes
creation of wealth or is it a society that promotes
looting of wealth.

Thanks
Rohit


--- vamsi@siliconcorp.com wrote:
>
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> Please help make the Manifesto better, or accept it,
> and propagate it!
>
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>
> You talk about "principles of forming US
> nation/state" where slavery was a big
> part of that country's equation!
>
> What you say about self-interest not being there
> among Indians is exactly
> opposite....I feel that Indians have too much
> self-interest and we do not
> think of the society as a whole!  For individuals to
> have meaningful
> self-interest there must be a society in which they
> can build their dreams
> from within.
>
> Sincerely,
> Vamsi M.
>
> Rohit Sharma wrote:
>
> > Yes, I can - the US.
> > India has one and only one core problem -
> altruism.
> > It comes up in form of religion, social structure.
> > For all the ancient wisdom and culture we have not
> > come up with the basic understanding that an
> > individual has to be the primary consideration. In
> > India an individual is crushed since his birth -
> by
> > social structures, religious reverence and
> inculcated
> > with the belief of self-disgust and pity. He is
> taught
> > to work for others - his family, his religion, his
> > country etc. never for himself. In our country we
> have
> > not come up with a fair understanding of life,
> > liberty, pursuit of hapiness (which is a cardinal
> sin
> > in all the religions practiced here) and right to
> > property.
> > Any serious analysis of history will realise that
> the
> > last 4 things - which came into human scope of
> > understanding in the Renaissance period and were
> the
> > principles of forming the US are the only truly
> > civilized form of human survival and prosperity.
> >
> > India as a country and as a culture fails to
> > understand this - though some if it's citizen do
> > realize these values.
> >
> > Rohit



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