[Date Prev][Date Next][Thread Prev][Thread Next][Date Index][Thread Index]

Re: Bizzare



---------------------------------------------------------------------
Please help make the Manifesto better, or accept it, and propagate it!
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Oh brother, here we go again......welcome to the First Church of
Impotent
Rage.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Sanjai Kukreti" <skukreti@home.com>
To: <debate@indiapolicy.org>
Sent: Wednesday, March 07, 2001 12:26 AM
Subject: Re: Bizzare


> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> Please help make the Manifesto better, or accept it, and propagate it!

> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> MV <maxv@vsnl.com> wrote:
> > History tells us, when Christians where prosecuted
> > in middle east some of them migrated to India. When
> > Parsies were prosecuted in Persia they migrated to
> > India. We all know, now there are only small number
> > of Christians in middle east and Parsies in Iran.
> >
> > If Babur destroyed so many temples and lakhs & lakhs
> > of infidels (vedic hindus) were sent to hell we should
> > expect large scale migration of vedic hindus from the
> > region conquered/ruled by Babur, is there any historic
> > evidence of this?
>
> Yes, there is a huge amount of historic evidence, including Babur's
own
> proclamations.
>
>
> >  How come there are still whole lot
> > of vedic hindus living in region ruled by Babur? We all
> > know that lots of them lived in what is now Pakistan
> > till the time of partisian, how can that be explained?
>
> Vedic HIndus? What are you talking about? Vedism is not the origin of
> the
> idol-worship that is practiced down to the lowest levels of society.
Who
> fed
> you this? Leftists?
> Vedism may have tried to accomodate such practices, but they pre-date
> the
> arrival/development of Vedic beliefs.
>
> Nextly, Babur conquered these areas, and destroyed their centres of
> power.
> Just like all the previous Aryan invaders before him. After all, if
> Aryan
> invaders conquered India, then how is it that most of us are all
> dark-skinned? Should we not be mostly white-skinned? The reality is
that
> all
> the Aryan invasions (pre-Islamic and post-Islamic) involved a small
> number
> of invaders defeating a larger number of natives. That is why the
> natives
> and their beliefs were not wiped out. Only the leaders were defeated.
> The peasants were largely left alone, until the Islamic rulers began
> their
> mission of converting everyone, to consolidate their control (eg.
Babur,
>
> Aurangzeb).
>
>
> > If the vedic hindus did not migrate when the Mughals
> > destroyed many of their temples and send lakhs of them
> > to hell or when British ruled them, why are they migrating
> > in large numbers from contemporary Independent India?
>
> Easy, because Leftists don't leave anyone unharassed. The Leftists
pour
> into
> every nook and cranny, and look to harass.
> "I am poor, you are not -- this must be because you have stolen from
me"
>
> "I want your property, I want your money, I want everything of yours
> that
> you have worked hard to earn"
>
> Unlike all the previous rulers of India, the Left leave no portion of
> society unharassed. I suppose that when one's ideology is about
creating
>
> stagnation, inefficiency,and deterioration,  then one is automatically

> forced to scour all parts of society, to squeeze whatever remaining
> value is
> left.
>
> If I work hard to better myself -- I don't want some Leftist vilifying

> me
> for it.
>
>
> > We should understand that the invasion of Mughals
> > and destruction of the temples were in themselves
> > a historic balancing act, it lead to the *downfall*
> > of social caste system in India. It is interesting
> > to note that till the caste system prevailed, vedic
> > hindus did not migrate from India.... This is
> > historic reality!
>
> Again, this is totally fabricated history.
>
> The caste system, as you call it, began in Africa. It came from the
> prominent tribal system that you see in place there even today.
> The people known as the Dravidians emerged from Africa and came to
> India,
> bringing those same tribal practices with them. There were then
various
> Dravidian tribes, some of them ruling over others, in a "caste
system".
>
> The Aryans invaded India, from Central Asia. As mentioned before,
small
> numbers of the invaders were able to defeat large numbers of the
locals
> in
> battle. Why? Because as we know, tribal societies are the ones more
> easily
> divided, and fall more easily to an enemy.
> Your own posts, along with those of the other leftists on here, are an

> example of this. Just as you today will speak up in defense of Babur
and
> the
> Moghul Aryan invaders, similarly during the original Aryan conquests
of
> India, the local Dravidian tribes on the bottom of the Dravidian caste

> system likewise did not object to someone overthrowing the other
> Dravidian
> tribes ("castes") ruling over them.
>
> That is why small numbers of Aryan invaders were originally able to
> quickly
> seize India. They did not interfere with the local cultural system
> ("caste
> system"), but just became the new rulers over it. Likewise, when the
> later
> Islamic Aryans invaded (eg. Moghuls such as Babur) they too did not
> interfere much with the local culture of those they had conquered,
other
>
> than to destroy the centers of power (ie. temples, which were the
> cultural
> centers of the defeated people).
>
> Just as the original Aryan invaders assimilated into the people whom
> they
> conquered (that's what happens when you are in the smaller numbers),
> likewise the Islamic Aryans later also began to acclimatize to India
> (eg.
> Akbar, who founded his own local faith, Din-e-Elahi)
>
> Look, those who aren't competent enough to solve problems relating to
> their
> social status, will always look to an outside invader for help.
> "Aryans, help me! I am a lower Dravidian caste, please help overthrow
> these
> dominant Dravidian castes and I will love you!"
> "Mughals, help me! I am a lower Hindu caste, please help overthrow
these
>
> dominant Hindu castes and I will love you!"
> "British, help me! I am a low caste, please help me overthrow these
> ruling
> Moghul and Hindu princes, and I will love you forever!"
> "Marxists, help me! I am still low after all this time, and I think
> everybody so far has let me down! Please liberate me from these
Brahmins
> or
> whoever the ruler is now, and I will love you forever!"
>
>
> I don't think that anyone in India needs a deity transplant, or a
ruler
> transplant. I think many need a backbone transplant, however, since
> their
> lack of spine seems to make them look for whatever superficial
cosmetic
> change they can get, without tackling the real problem.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------
This is the National Debate on System Reform.       debate@indiapolicy.org
Rules, Procedures, Archives:            http://www.indiapolicy.org/debate/
-------------------------------------------------------------------------